Marisa Raymond - What If This Was Fun?

Welcome to the real people real business show where we are talking with business owners who are in the trenches everyday , people who are working hard and have relevant and inspiring stories that you can relate to. Everyone we speak to is actively building and growing their business and is here to share their experiences, lessons, wisdom, and guidance so you can be inspired to take action towards our own goals. Today I'm excited to welcome Marissa Raymond , who's a mindfulness coach and yoga teacher for stressed out families. Oh my goodness. I bet you are busy. She believes that if we have more fun in our lives, we can find a lot more peace and patience in our everyday activities. I love this. So welcome to the show, Marissa , and thanks so much for taking the time to share your story.

I'm so excited to be here. It's so great to see you, Stephanie.

Oh, I'm so excited to have you here too. I've been wanting you on the show to talk about the work you do because it's so important and because so many people need you. Um, okay, let's just get started. I want to hear your story. How did you get to where you are right now?

Oh my gosh. So it's a really long convoluted story, but um, to , uh, get to the juicy parts. Um, I am a genetic counselor by training and I was working at children's hospital in Colorado and then , um, my husband was offered a sabbatical here in Bordeaux, France. Uh, and I had just come back from maternity leave, so I was like, yeah, okay, sure. That takes three more months and go to France. Um, when will we ever do that again? And then , um, as we, when we came back, he was offered a permanent position. So I had literally just gotten back. We had just, I just started working again and then he was like , uh , do you want to move to France permanently? So , um , we said yes, obviously. And we came back and when I found out when we got to France was that my American diplomas are useless, completely useless. So I was basically told, you have to do your diploma all over again. If you want to work as a genetic counselor or you have to figure something else out. Um, and so I was like, Oh, well, you know, we're just, cause we're thinking two to three years, so I won't really take, like, I want to invest in an education like redoing my diploma and I want to invest in figuring something else. Now I'll just be a stay at home mom. And that very quickly it was like, I love my kids but like I need more. Um, and it was more serious than that. Like I ha I burnt out. I got very, very sick. Um, and I knew that for my own health I needed to get meantime , um, and sort of separate from my kids. So , um, I started teaching English and which is what a lot of ex pats here do. And , uh, it just wasn't really fulfilling and I didn't really feel like aligned. And I just started thinking like, how do I bring genetics back? How do I bring the stuff I loved about being a genetic counselor? That coaching back that the counseling part into my world. And , uh , and then I hired a life coach to kinda help me figure it out. And I was like, dude, I can do this. This is exactly what I'm missing, these conversations. So , uh , I went to life coaching school and I at the same time a friend approached me and was like, you do yoga, will you teach yoga at my gym? So I did my yoga certification and through that I started teaching yoga to kids at her gym and they, it just, everything kind of clicked where I love working with kids and I could see that my health is actually getting better. Like I can show up on a yoga mat and do asanas and whatever, you know, all day. But I would get off the mat and get stressed again. But when I was showing up on a yoga mat with kids, like doing lions pose and like pretending to be airplanes, it was like I would get off the mat and just have so much fun and my kids and I would engage cause they would do it with me. And so our whole life at home was changing and I was like, yeah, right. This is, this is this, this is the special sauce. Right. This is how it all fits. So here we are. That's it. So you've, you have actually formalized now that that service working with kids and families. Yeah. Yeah. So a big part of my, what I realized fairly early on was that , um, I was hearing a lot of parents who are coming to my yoga classes saying like, Oh, my kid still needs to relax because they're so crazy at home. And then they would watch my yoga class where we get crazy and kind of, you know, it's really fun and playful and they're like, Oh , that doesn't really look relaxing. Like I don't, but then the kids would sleep better at night and the kids, you know, cause I still talk with the children about, you know , how to breathe and do those kinds of things. Um, and I noticed really quickly that like as parents, we want to have mindful, calm children, but we're not mindful, calm people. So we don't model the behavior. And I totally own this myself. Like I wasn't modeling the behavior. And so the coaching piece of my business is around kind of working with parents about how to create more ease and joy. These moments of magic, cause life's going to be chaotic, right? Like let's get real, can't you can't stop the chaos. Um, but as we start being more mindful and incorporating more play and ease and joy into our lives, the kids see that and then everything just sort of starts rippling down. And so I could teach kids yoga until I'm blue in the face that their behavior at home wasn't going to change if the parent's behavior at home didn't change. So I've really combined that and because we're here in France , um , I also teach yoga in English. I hate, so I've like created this little niche locally where , um, kids aren't learning English by coming to my yoga classes. So it's going to be killing two birds with one stone. But then also being able to work with, with the parents so that this , it's not just that one hour a week that the kids are in my class. It's, it's stuff that they can take home and incorporate as a family. So tell me what , what working with somebody looks like for you? I mean, this , this sounds like fun, like this sounds like fun for you and fun for them. It is. So, I mean I'll just sort of focus on like working with the adults in it. Um, uh, so we do a couple of different things when you work together. Um, the very first thing is just kind of talking about where they are. Like, what feels super heavy in your life right now? Where, where, where can you see that the problems are kind of connecting to you? Right? So that's sort of like the mind, the mindfulness piece of it, and then kind of connecting to like, what were you like as a kid? What was fun for you as a kid and how can you incorporate little moments of that , um, into your life, you know? So if you're in your business life, like how can you have more fun doing that task at work that you don't want to do? Like, you know, it happens all the time. I hate writing social media content. Like how can I make that fun? Um, and, and then you know, also looking at like what are you notice about your kids? Like when are they having fun? Cause I do work with people who don't know, who don't have children , um, as well, but when there's a child, when the children should child involved , like what do you notice your kid enjoying? So how can you take a look at what your kid is enjoying and find what's fun in that for you? Cause the worst thing, I have two boys. I hate, like part of why I was burning out was like my young, my older son just was obsessed with cars and when he was like three, like there was only so many times I could drive a car along the track and like try and make up stories and be told like, no, that car doesn't talk that way. Or like that's not the track that that card was up . Right. Like you want to engage with your kids and they're just like, no, this is how the game gets played. So it gets frustrating. But there are moments where you could be like, okay, you're the boss of this game and like what can I do that's fun? Like help me have fun with you here. And there's a way. So part of what working with parents as well is how do you communicate better with your children? Especially when they're in those ages where you know they're little narcissists because they're three years old and they haven't learned empathy and they don't care what you want. You can still communicate and still figure out how to have fun in those moments so that you're not spending family time being like, Oh, when is it over? And families , you know you can make it quality time. Parenting is hard, right? It's this really weird assault on your, and

I, I can totally relate to what you're talking about because I get so caught up in all of the things that I'm thinking about on the all the time. And my kids are like, I remember when they used to be like, let's play hide and seek. And I'd be like, no . Oh no, not again. I hate hide and seek like what is it about hide and seek that kids loved . Even now my kids are like nine and 11 almost like 10 and 12 and they will still play hide and seek. I'm like, what? No, I could , I just literally could not have fun doing it. I would just literally sign out. I would be like, Nope, Nope. The sooner I could get them playing on their own. And so like how do you find the fun and how do you find the fun in something you just really don't enjoy?

Yeah, I mean that's such a great question and I think look like they're going to be times where you can't. Right ? I mean especially like, you know, when we kind of start doing the mindset work about it and looking back like what is it about hide and seek that you don't like? Um, cause sometimes when like, you know, there is some story from our childhood or there's some reason we don't like hide and seek and being aware of that then kind of help , like helps us take our ego out of it and be like, Oh right. Like I played hide and seek with my brother when we were little or I know you have a sister like and she left me for like 40 minutes cause she got bored. Like I'm just making , you know, obviously making up this story, but like maybe you were in a closet hiding and nobody came to find you and you don't remember that story. But that's why you don't like it. Right? So kind of like dissecting like what are, what, what's the story I'm telling myself here that I don't like for me with, with my son's cars, it really was that like he was telling me what to do. Like he was like, no , like every time I was like trying to be creative and calm with ideas, he was like, Nope, Nope. That's not how the car, that's not how this game is played. And I don't like being told what to do. So once I was, I can't and we don't . And that's the thing, right? Like we, part of why parenting is so hard, I think on a fundamental level is because we don't have control, right? Like we want to raise independent, strong, smart, I would spoken children, but we don't want them to be independent and outspoken and strong with us. Like we want to be able to be like I'm the parent, you're the kid, this is the hierarchy, this is how it works. And the second that we can sort of shift back and be like, Oh yeah, right, like how do I come to their level? How do I help them come up to me? How do I meet them in this like special place? And even if it's for five minutes look like that was one of the things I realized like my son had no concept of time when he was three. So what he wanted was me to be there and be fully engaged. And if I could do that for five minutes, then I could go do the other thing I wanted to do and he was going to leave me alone and play by himself. So like if you can play hide and seek for

10 minutes with your kid, for example, my, their kids [inaudible] like they love it cause you're there and you're present. And you're in the moment and then they're like, okay mom, like enough, like now you've talked to me, we have nothing else to say to you. Like go do what you need to do. And like sometimes it's as simple as that, right? Just giving yourself permission to for 10 minutes to do this thing. And sometimes it is dissecting, why don't I like this? Because then it's like, Oh yeah, it's not this that I don't like, it's this component of this game. And if I can shift that and this game is, is, you know, it's more fun. That makes sense. Yeah, it totally does. And I mean, part of the problem is that kids, especially when they're little, they're little obsessors right? So my son is obsessed about cars too. Like car, like it just, it was my, my daughter obsessed about balls. She would , um , she would, I would sit at the computer with her and we would just do a Google search for [inaudible] ball and it would show all these different pictures of balls. And I have a video of her sitting there cause it was so funny. She was probably one, maybe [inaudible] and she would sit on my lap and she would go, Oh , Oh , Oh. And like she could do this for hours. And I'd just be like, ah, Oh , I know . And my son obsessed about cars and they go through this obsession phase, right? And they go through, they have to go through this obsession phase. And so that, I think that becomes part of the TD of right. But I think what you're doing is so is so fascinating because it's not just a surficial kind of well start having fun. This is actually digging down to the fact the recognition that parents are humans too, and that we actually have preferences and that we want to be satisfied as well. And that we also have a lot of shit going on. Right. And I think that's always been the hardest thing for me is that I've got so many things going on all the time that it's hard to decouple those and just be present with my kids. But I've been noticing, especially lately that my son needs that a lot. Right now he's nine. He is going through whatever he's going through and I've, I've just stopped trying to marry , uh , what I need and what he needs and just sitting there with him, he's just like, mommy, mommy, mommy. Look at my literally 23 page Christmas list and let's go through it and I want you to read every single one of them. I'm like, you kidding me? And then I'm like, no, this is what he wants. And so it took me five minutes. I sat on the couch and I read every single damn thing on that 23 pay . I'm not even kidding. It's stapled together 23 pages. And his logic is, well, I've just kind of collected everything that I like and everything that I want in this Christmas list and I'm sending it to Santa, but I've got a note on it to ask him to send it back to me so I can reuse it next year and check off the things that came already and I'll just send it back to him. I'm like, Oh my God. I it setting goals like his little mind is he starting to really develop his personality now. Whereas before he was kind of just this little narcissistic, you know, little boy, which is totally normal and whatever. But he's had these little like things are emerging and I feel so scared that I'm going to miss them. But he's got his own little personality. And I mean one of the things on his Christmas list was a trip to Dubai. I'm like, what? How do you even know where Dubai is or even that it exists? So he's, he's funny and he's got his little quirks, but we don't, we miss, we miss miss them if we are not engaging, but there's gotta be a way to engage that kind of works for both people. And I see this sort of trend emerging with parenting that we are starting to allow ourselves to be people, right? And to be human beings. And I like my kids get that too, which is great. And I was apologizing to them for being kind of a jerk and they said, you know what I mean, you're tired, you're hungry. And they said, don't worry about it. We, we like you just as you are.

And I'm like ,

but I mean this whole, this whole piece of work that you've got going on is, is actually so much deeper than just trying to find fun. Right? This is trying to find this marriage of who we are and who our kids are and where that intersects. Right?

Yeah. And what I love about what you're sharing, like, and that's exactly it, like the story that you're sharing about your son and taking the time to read through his list. I'm on that 23 page list. Um, it's like what you said about like finding his quirks, right? Like these are things that we don't know about our kids. Like where did he learn about Dubai? Like, so maybe like your , you know, like at first it's like, Oh, and then when you're sitting there and you're like, how did you learn about Dubai? What's that about? Like you can start having these conversations and like you're saying, see their personalities emerge. And when you were sharing the story about like, you know, the city , the ball and the tedium of it, like watching these videos, like now looking back on it, you're laughing and I can like see in your face like those are memories that we actually like connect to. Right? And they , it happen so fast. Like it's like when you're in it, it feels like it's taking for freaking ever. Right. But like when we're sitting back and looking at it and my kids are eight and almost 12 so it's like the same age and it's like, wow, like where did the time go? And their personalities are totally different now and they in some ways are the same, but in other ways like, you know, they're interested in different things and like, and they're going to be different six months from now, I'm going to meet, we live so far away and when we go visit grandparents that, you know, they say that all the time. Like, Oh, like last time we saw them, they were interested in this and now they're interested in that. Like, where did this, how did that happen? And I , you see it every day cause you're watching it. So we're not necessarily as mindful about how quickly they're changing until we look back and it's like, you know, eight years later like , Oh, right. Like I used to sit and watch these videos and like now, like I don't have that much time and I think I'm in the stage when my son just started middle school where I'm seeing like how quick it's happening in like six years from now he's going to be, you know, an adult is to be 18. I want him to know that I've been there. I want to create this relationship with him now and get to know him and get to meet him on his level. Um, and yeah, and I think at the same time what you're saying about, you know, doing the work on ourselves, like we are people, which means like we come with our own baggage. We come with our own emotional wounds. So part of like being the best parent that we could be or even the best person we can be is looking at what are those wounds looking at, what are the, what's the baggage we're showing up with in the world? Like do is that baggage we still want to be carrying ? Um, is how has that baggage affecting our relationships? It doesn't necessarily have to be with, you know, our children, but um, just even our relationships with like the supermarket cashier person sometimes, right? Like, do I really want to yell at this person because she's taking too long? Like, or is that about me being like, I've got like, I don't have enough time and money, right ? Or I don't have enough time for this but count this, count my money, let me go. So like it , it totally ripples when you start like looking at your own patterns and healing those wounds in yourself. And like you said, then your kid, you're modeling that for your kids. And so you're also, you know, we're always going to create wounds and our kids, whatever, they're going to grow up to have their own wounds. But at least they won't have the wounds that we have if we're conscious about them. And I think it just really at the end of the day, like we have one life and we're each individuals. So like no one person, no one expert can tell you what to do to be a better parent or to tell you how to talk to your child. Like it's so individual and being a coach and being able like , you know, that's something I learned from my genetic counseling background. Like every single client, regardless of if they had the same genetic mutation, they had all this other family stuff going on that in like affected how this disease, this diagnosis was fitting into their life or not. And so I had to walk into every client setting being like, you're an individual and , and you have this one gene that's, that's, you know, affected , but you have 29,000 other genes that aren't. So let's figure out like how, what you need and individualizing that kind of , uh , that kind of , um, uh, of , of work allows people to also really dive in deep and know that they're being seen and heard. And it's not about trying to fit them into a box. Cause I think fundamentally that's what we're all rebelling about too , right? Like none of us want to be in a box anymore. Send me out.

We know that that didn't work for previous generations. Right. And that's, I think that's a rally cry now for this generation that's going through parenting and kind of growing up and hopefully passing those things along to our kids. And maybe they'll make them better too. But I think what's really interesting is that the , the parallels, I mean you were a genetic counselor, but there's actually a lot of parallels from the work you did as a genetic counselor into the work that you're doing now with people. And I think the, eh , well you were dealing with people before too, but just with, with parents. Right. And I think what's curious is that you talk about your work helping people have more fun, but actually what you're doing is you're helping them build connection with their children.

Yeah. Yeah. And I think letting go, that stability, being able to build connection is in large part about letting go of your guilt about not your kid not being perfect or you not being perfect. Right. And whether it's, you know,

Hmm .

That came up, that was such a huge theme in genetic counseling because these, like your gene , you're passing on the genes to your child. So there was so much guilt that we had to sort of unpackage and deal with. Um, and it just, it again, it's like one of those things that we all have, but we all express differently and yeah, absolutely. Like to create these connections truly and deeply, you have to be able to be connected with yourself and to do the work and to see like where are you putting up walls because of things that happen because of baggage that you're carrying because of beliefs that you have , um,

that you know,

a lot of which were sort of implanted in you from your parents, right? Like , and then, or from society like Anders really like you said, decoupling. Like what do I truly believe in? Who do I truly want to believe? Who do I truly want to be and how do I truly want to connect with? What do I think I should do? Um, and that's where the connection starts. And I think yoga taught me that a lot too. Like you have the connection between you and yourself , um , comes before you really can, like put it out fully and authentically and honestly into the world.

Now, you and I met because we work on a coaching team together for Jenny. She's program. And in that program you are working with business owners. I mean, this is , uh , this is , uh , a far, arguably a far less emotionally charged , um, subject area. And so how are you, how do you see the parallels with the work that you do in the program that we coach in as opposed to the work that you do with families and with parents and with the kids?

Wow, I love that question. And you know, if you'd asked me before we started talking, I probably wouldn't have had an answer, but this conversation like, just like as soon as you said that, I instantly like, well, because business owners think of their business as a baby, right? Like we have that we want to be present, we want to , we have guilt about how much time we're spending with our, with our business. We have guilt about how much time we're spending in our business and not with our family. Like, and if that seems or thing of like guilt about spending too much time with one child and not the other. Like there's so many parallels when we create our own business around like about parenting. Um , and whether or not you're a parent , you still have that love and connection with your business. So yeah, I hadn't really made that connection before, but I think that's really, that's really what it is. Because you eat , you're a success coach in the program that we coach it and you use, you help people with all of this mindset stuff that they're going through and , and sort of the softer sizes side of business, right? So what are we, what are we doing in our businesses that are keeping us in the same role that we are as parents that are , that feels a little bit stuck. I mean, what do we do on the mindset level? Yeah. I mean, you know, it's so funny we had this thing last year, right? Where , um , I think, I can't remember if it was Jenny or where the cocaine from, but strategy eats mines or mindset eat strategy for breakfast, right? Like where , um , digging into the mindset helps you see where you're getting stuck in your strategy. And so I think , um, you know, some of the parallels , um, are really about control. Like, I'm putting out the social meet , I'm putting out the social media, I'm showing up, I'm, I'm being a sir , I'm doing, I'm ticking all the boxes that Jenny telling me to take, but nothing's happening, right? And it's like, okay, well let's sit down and talk about this. Like, you , you want this control that sort of falls . You have no control over whether people show up. You only have to control or what comes out and which is very similar like your children, right? Um, you can, you can put things out there and ask your children in a certain way and you have no control over how they're going to respond. But you can shift how you talk to your children. You can shift how you're showing up. You can shift your thoughts and beliefs about being a service, about , um, client, getting activities in a way that makes it feel like you're showing up more authentically and more present and , um, so that you can start feeling connected to it so that you're truly being you and not living in that sort of scarcity mindset of like, I'm putting it all out there. And I'm trying to be in control and I feel so out of control cause nothing's happening. Um, so I think that's probably the biggest one is that we, we so want to control our business and control the Mmm . You know , what our business looks like. And I think we also , um, struggle with boundaries. Um, and some of us do more than others, but to a certain extent, when, you know, when you're a solo and you're running your own business, like you could work on your business 24, seven, right? Like you're sitting at home, the computers there , like where you ha you want, you, you start a business because you want to serve clients. So where do you create that boundary for yourself? Between this is who I am, this is, this is my, my work life and this is my business. Right? Which is very similar to like who am I as a person, the boundary of me and the boundary of me in the role as a parent. Um, so it's the boundary of , you know, you, and then you, and your role as a business owner. Um, so there are like all your , I I love this analogy because it , it really, I, yeah, I feel like you've just sparked this like bright. That's why it works. You know ,

the other piece that sort of strikes me is that when we dug into your business, what we recognized is that ultimately what you're trying to do is allow people to make better connections with their children. Well, isn't that what we're trying to do in business as well? Isn't that what propels our business forward is when we can make better connections with our potential clients, right? And, and connection and engagement is, and relationship building is the foundation of selling your business. It is the foundation of selling what you sell. And the more connection we can create, the more trusted we become with our audience. So can we have fun in our business and allow that to help us create connections as business owners?

Yeah. So I , um, this is something that I learned from Karen Gillan , um, where like, and she calls me on it still a lot. Like it's the, how do you, like what if this were easy, right? Like, there are these sort of questions you can ask yourself when you get stuck. And, and so I've sort of flipped that into like, what if this were fun, right? Or, or easy or what if this was more playful? Like how, how can you show up in this thing where you feel stuck? So that , um , with a different mindset, right, with that sort of that energy around like, you know, this is something I get to do instead of this is something I have to do. And I think when we start looking at , um, things we're doing that feel heavy in our business or that we don't like to do with that mindset of how can I make this more fun? If the answer is I can't, then maybe this is not the right thing for you to be doing, right? So if you're going, you know, writing newsletters and it's like, you can't , like, you can't think of content and you're really struggling and like, and so you're not putting them out there. Like, maybe a weekly newsletter isn't the best activity for you to be spending your time on. Especially if you're trying to set boundaries around, you know, if you're not in your business full time or if you are in your business full time. But this came up the other day with a client , um, uh, in the mastermind about , um, how about around being of service, right? Like spending all this time in social media on Facebook, like being serviced and it's like, okay, well, and it was starting to feel heavy because people weren't coming back and like hiring her and, and it was like, okay, well how could you make that part fun? Like w what's missing from like I'm being of service to them hiring me. Right? And she was like, Oh, right, I'm not telling them that they can hire me. I'm just being of service. I was like, okay, well what comes up when you say that? Oh, like that's really uncomfortable. Like this is a Facebook group. Like, I don't want to be sell salesy and blah, blah, blah. And I was like, okay, how can that be more fun? Like how can that be more enjoyable? And instantly when she was able to kind of create that, take that next step, she booked several , um , client getting or several coffee chats , um, you know , um, discovery calls, like things started happening because instead of it being, the thing that was blocking her was she was connecting just fine with these people, but she wasn't telling them what you did and she didn't realize she wasn't telling them what she did because she's like, well, I'm connecting with you. I'm like, shouldn't you just know through osmosis? So I think, yeah. I don't know if that answers your question, but I think that's, I think that's really it, right? It's where like , we, okay . Just kind of [inaudible] these little hacks or what, you know, these, these showing up. Like how do I make this more fun or how do I ground myself in a way? Mmm . Where , cause sometimes you have to do, like I said, you know, with parenting, like there's always going to be chaos. There's always gonna be things you don't want to do. Like you have to wipe poopy butts. Like that just happens, right? Like you have to deal with vomit on your clothes. Like that happens when you have a baby. I had , it's terrible, but it happens. So like, you know, I'm not saying like, Oh, how can you make that fun? Like, yeah, you got bonded on, but you know, kind of like there are ways that when those things come up where you can say like, is this the right thing in my business? Is this the right thing? I feel like I'm getting vomited on when I go on Instagram. Okay, well maybe Instagram is not the place that you should be. Maybe you should be in PR networking. Like are there networking events you can go to? Are there, like what is it that feels fun? What feels like for you and the, I mean, I do a lot of work with my clients on alignment, right? Because to me, alignment is, is the absolute Mmm Holy Bible of getting your business right. And if you don't have the alignment from the beginning, you're going to build a business that you hate. And guess what happens when you have a business that you hate, you don't want to do anything anymore. Right ? Right . And that's a journey that finding that right thing, that fighting that right way of it, the finding

the right skills to use. There's those, you know , kind of four pillars of alignment. So , um, what that leads me to ask you is that, okay, so life coaching is a, there are a lot of life coaches out there, right? It's a very broad kind of sometimes misunderstood , um, hard to place , um, profession and you really need to differentiate yourself within the life coaching. Just like in business coaching, like there is all manner of business coaches, right? Um , truly business coaches, some, not business coaches at all, but this, you know, these are, these are some concepts that get kinda thrown around. So in terms of alignment, how have you created a business that's aligned with you and how are you differentiating yourself out there in the market?

Oh, such a good question. Um, I've definitely been there where I didn't feel aligned with my business. Um, and to be honest, I, I still feel like I'm tweaking it. I mean, you know, this, cause we've talked about it. Um, but in, in large part, because I think , um, you know, like Jenny's, as clarity comes from taking action. And so the more action I take, the more it's like, am I, is the message right? Am I, am I calling myself the right thing? Is this really? And , um, and it's so easy to get into sort of perfectionist mode of like, well, I'm not really a parenting coach. I'm not really like I'm a yoga T . like I kind of do all these different things and there's no word for that. And so I think for me it was really, really , um, giving myself permission to just sit with that and be like, all right , I'm not going to have the perfect word for myself. Like I'm just doing what I'm doing and , and it feels good and sort of , and that's where the Alliance getting into alignment kind of clicked for me. It was trying not to be in alignment or not like pressuring myself to find the alignment and getting to just be me. Um , and a lot of that stuff that a lot of that comes from comparisonitis, right? Like you said that there's so many people out there, so you're trying to be different and unique, but you're also comparing yourself to others. So you're kind of in some ways trying to be the same like , um, and just really owning , um, for me like, yeah, like I said, just giving myself permission to not feel pressure about having the right words or having the right , um, doing it the right way has allowed me to do it my way, which feels right.

Yeah. And there , listen, there is no right way and I hope there's never a right way because you know, by bucking that trend, we're creating businesses with these amazing people that are filling the innovation gaps that we really needed to see. And in my experience, the, what you call yourself is just a way, it's just a F a S sort of a flag in the ground to help people find you. And then they get to learn more about you and figure out if you are that that thing for them. So I've always hated the term business coach. I, I think it's misleading. I think that it's, it's far too widely defined for people to really understand what it is. But because people are looking for that, who want to find me, that's the word that they use. So, okay, I'm going to put up my, I'm going to put up my flag and say I'm a business coach, but here's how I'm different. Right? So it's the words that I use, it's the branding, it's the messaging that I, I portray that's actually more important and helps my people decide whether I am the right one for them or not. So I don't, I don't know that any of these terms like yes, your life coach, but that just, that just helps people situate you. And I find when people try to get a little bit fancy with their, you know, with those statements, they confuse their ideal clients and they don't know what, therefore it's [inaudible]

yeah , maybe you can use themselves, right? And like your, your question about like how do I differentiate myself and , and again, like you and I've sort of talked about this a lot and, and I've seen you shift between when we first met, we were in , make it work online as clients together , um , and then became coaches together. Um , is that like, it's also about owning all of those different pieces of you? Right. So like , um, when I started, a big part of the identity of my identity was still around being a genetic counselor. And it's still really hard. Some days , like we were just back in the States at a family event and like all, like I have so many cousins that are like doctors and lawyers and like are doing like the right thing in terms of like, they're on the right path in terms of how we were raised. Um, and it was really hard , um, on the plane, like started having this panic attack of like, Oh my God, they're gonna ask me what I do. Cause I haven't seen them on so long and like, I'm gonna have to be like, Oh, I'm a life coach. And they're gonna laugh at me like I'm a yoga teacher. Right? Like those still all those stories kinda came in. I'm like, I'm just, it's just easier to salmon genetic counselor. Like they don't really need to know. And like , um , and I still do just some genetic counseling. Like I still have a freelance business. So it was like, you know , um, but yeah, like that was an old story and I showed up and of course like I was like, Oh man , yoga teacher. And they were like in France. Like, that's awesome. I wish I could be like, we have these stories and being able to take the experiences that we have, being able to take all the pieces of our personality. Um, yeah, there's so many life coaches out there and there's so many business coaches out there and there's so many holistic health coaches out there and like, whatever it is that you are okay , but there's only one

you and all of your experiences, your personal experiences and your professional experiences brought you to where you are today. So trying to fit into that box again of like , this is what a business coach is , is when a life coach is , and, and without pulling those experiences into it is just not being authentic. Um, and so I think that finding that alignment is really about peeing . Like , Oh yeah, here are all the things that I am, here are all the things that I do and then I can do. And all the, like the expertise that I have, I'm putting that in quotes because you don't have to be an expert in it . Right ? It's like you're in all these experiences that make me who I am and make me show up in my business the way I am and that's what's going to attract the right people to you. I think , um , when I was working with, when we were working together to like, you know, it was like, do you have time for a 7 billion clients? No. So you don't want to be speaking to 7 billion people. I mean, that was so powerful for me. Like, Oh yeah. And when I look at my business and I look at, you know , the amount of space I have in my business for clients, Mmm . I don't have space for, you know, for even 10 clients a week. So trying to sit there with the mentality of I have to fill my roster with 10 clients is not authentic or in alignment with what I want. Um , that's the should, right. So yeah, like being conscious of who are you, what do you want, what , what is everything that you have to offer? And putting that out there, that's what brings the right people to you. And the alignment of our goals with our [inaudible] business as well as just as important. Like, I ha , I think we all adopt this, this the assumption that we need to build these huge audiences and, and have all these people coming to us all the time. But just to your point, like the last module that I do with my clients in my program is all about getting clear on your capacity and your capacity is totally tied to your goals as a person and us for your lifestyle and your constraints and all of that sort of thing. So I've got a client who is constantly stressing about, Oh my God, Oh my God, I have to get a whole bunch of our clients. I'm like, no, you don't look at your capacity right now. You need one more client and you'll be good for the rest of the year. And she's like, Oh, that changes your perspective and your anxiety around going up . She's like, Oh, I've got to go do all these marketing things. I'm like, no, you need to have a couple of conversations. That's it because you're going to find another client and that's all you needed because you can't handle more clients if you had more Clinton. Now she's actually in that. She hasn't even done any marketing. Now she's in this position where she's like four , four potential new clients who have just come to her and she's like, Oh God, what do I do now? I'm like, see, you didn't need to stress. Like , let the , putting that realistic lens on our business is really important. Um, I want to ask you , um,

what , what's the one thing that you wish you had known before you got started? What would be really helpful for all of our listeners to sort of, no, and take away with them so that they can be a little bit further ahead as they go through their journeys? Um , such a , there's so many things I wish I had known. I think the one that stands out for me the most is exactly what we're talking about, about alignment. Like , um , taking the time before I got started to really sit with what, what do I know? Um , what like, you know, what are my expertise? What are my personal experiences, my professional experiences , um, that I can bring into this business and what do I want my business to look like? Like, I wish I had , um, before I started sat down with a calendar and blocked out, this is my non-negotiable time, or Hey, like this is the time and I'm not sure I necessarily knew that when I started my business because my, like, I, so there's obviously like these things shift, but even at the time, like I knew when I started my business that I wanted to be able to pick up my kids at school at four 30, which meant , and they don't have school on Wednesdays, which meant like blocking out Wednesdays and blocking out like, you know, four to six or whatever. So that I could be, I could pay , I didn't have to decide, do I take this client who can only, you know , meet from four to five? Like, no, no, I can't. I can't be there for you at four to five because I have to be at school at four 30. I wish I had known that there was so much. Um, I had so many shuts . Like, Oh, you're running this business full time, so you should be working from nine to five. And so your kids should go to daycare, you know, to the gut , to the afterschool program and you can pick them up afterwards. And like that totally works for some people. It's just not what I wanted. Um, and I knew that I want, like in my heart, I knew that and I fought it for so long that I was really struggling with , um, I was, I was spinning my wheels, I was blocking myself. I wasn't getting those clients who were coming from, you know, who work like that . Cause I was like, Oh, like you were just saying with like this kindness , like, you know, the stress that was me. It was like, Oh, but like I have to fill this spot. And so I have to have that my calendar open from four to five, but I don't want my calendar open for 45 . So I think that's the biggest thing I wish I had known was um , to really do the planning of what I wanted my business to look like before kind of launching it. Um, and cause everything else would have fallen into place more smoothly. Like I think I would have fought everything else less if I had started with the, this is, this is one of my business to look like and it not , not even necessarily who I wanted to work with and that kind of stuff. Like I think that piece can come once you know how much, like how much time you have to, you have for your bit and then finding who your ideal

client is can come kind of on a second. The first thing is really getting clear I think on what, what are your non negotiables? Yup . I mean I could talk to you about this for another hour because this is like so fundamental to everything that I do too in the way that I've built my programs. Because my big thing is that you can have everything that you want and people don't believe that. But this, this module that we do is all about starting your scheduling with you , with what you want your life to look like. Now you, it's interesting cause I go through these four pillars of passion and some people we , we get taught to build our business. You know , you go to business school, you go take any of these courses, you're taught to start with your customer. But that's not real for a lot of people. For some people it is. And when you, when you dig in with them, you realize that for them it's all about working with this one particular group of people and that's what lights them up. So in that regard, the traditional models of business design actually work. But if I had built my business around the customer, I would have a business that I hated because my pillar, my, my important thing is not the customer. It's the way that I want to work. It sounds like that's the , the key for you too . So we would start there and work from that as being the point that we make decisions now. Even even if it's not your pillar. When we get to this point where we're designing a business around or you're designing your work schedule, it's all about w what how you want, and people aren't used to to , especially women. We're not used to asking for what we want, right? We're not, we're not used to being able to say, no, I'm going, I need every second Friday off. I need every Friday off. I need every second week to be a no client week. Whatever it is, you all have very personal requirements and if we don't honor those, you end up feeling resentful. We want to take all of that friction out of your business. So that's really interesting for me to hear because I wouldn't have, I wouldn't have pegged you that being your pillar, but it's so clear to me that that's, that's the thing that needs to be true in your business and it's , it's the same way in mind , right? Just for different things. So we can have these very specific and customized businesses. We can put a structure in place underneath them so that we have everything that we need in order to get the freedom that we really want, but we really, really have to be able to customize our businesses. And it sounds like that's kind of what you're working towards. Yeah, I mean I think it gets back to that connection piece, right? That we were talking about like connecting with myself and connecting with my family and connecting with my values and like, and then building my business on that . Like the foundation of, you know, of the house of the business is me. So if I

don't know what I want, if I don't know what are my non-negotiables, then I'm doing a disservice to my clients and to myself in building a business on this sort of really shaky foundation.

Totally. Okay. I've got a question that I ask everybody because I liked , I like to hear the answers and it's something near and dear to my heart. Um, what's the, what do you think the biggest gap is between what we are told, what we see out there in the world, in the online business world and what's actually real?

Okay . Um, I mean, my, the instant thing, I thought it was done. It's easy. You know, I mean, I think, and I, I it, it bothers me so much when I see ads that are like, you can do it just like me , if you can build a six figure business in six weeks or less, right? Like maybe if you were working 130 hours a week, right? Like I have this, my, my husband's a big Tim Ferris fan and when he bought four hour work week, that was my huge thing. I didn't realize at the time, but I was like, there's just no way that you can build a successful business in four hours a week. And then I started reading about Tim Ferriss and like people who knew him and they were like, no, he's a workaholic. It's just what he calls work tasks that he's doing four hours a week. Right. But he's always planning and like setting goals and con connecting with people and like, but he's not counting that. And so I think, yeah, I think just again like goes to the like you need to be you. And I think there's so much out there about like, here's this box. Put yourself in it. And that's just not real. Um , it's useful. It's helpful. It's a good, you know, but you're not going to build your foundation on somebody else's box .

No, I think that there's a big, a big misconception and a lot of silly marketing around the fact that business owners don't want to work. I don't think that's true at all. I don't think that's what people are seeking. I mean, I certainly have done work with my clients where what they were seeking was not more money but a more balanced and like to make the same amount of money doing, I'm not going crazy and burning themselves out. So, but they're , they're totally happy to do the work. They just don't want to have to feel like they have to do the work. They don't have no choice right. Thereafter choice thereafter after some, some flexibility. So they might be working 40 hour work weeks and they're perfectly happy to do that. They just don't want to be working 80 hour weeks in order to see them make the same amount of money. So this could , this misconception that people don't want to work is actually a bunch of BS. Right?

Yeah. And I think it gets back again to like that like the control and the connection and knowing , um, you know, what, what your goals are, why you're leaving the , you know , why you're starting your business. Um, and I would say, you know, for me , um, I didn't really have, you know, like I said, I didn't have a choice. I mean, I did, we could have chosen not to move to France, but once we moved to France like it, and it was like you have to come up with something to do , um, and it, and it's not, it can't be the thing that you had been doing. Part of what I was really struggling with. And I think a lot of, I've heard this from a lot of the clients and make it work online as well when they're leaving. Kind of this more structured , um, you know, corporate life or , um, like that nine to five job is you have to do everything in your business when you're a solo entrepreneur. So you have to go outside of your comfort zone so much because you, you're the CEO of this business. You have to do the admin tasks, you have to do the social media stuff like you can, and if you're lucky enough to hire those people early on, but you even have to know that that's part of what it takes so that you can hire those people, right ? Like , and I think that's a big part of what you're seeing too. Like we, we, we have this expectation in this idea that like, it's going to be easy that or that , um, you know, that we don't like to work, but you're doing so many other, you have so many hats that you're wearing. Um, but like I said, I mean, you can get sucked into that. And I think for a long time when I started my business, that's what, that's what was slowing me down too was this like, but I don't know how to do that. How do I do that? Who can I get to help? Like what expert PD? Like what opt in freebie can I download? What course can I pay for? What? Like who's going to tell me how to build this roadmap to create this perfect business? Um, and you know, in some ways that's how I found Jenny and make it work online. And there's awesome stuff that I've gotten from Jenny, right? And like, I can't even like words can't express how honored I am to have been part of her program and to continue to be part of her program as a coach. And I've learned from Jenny that some of the stuff an expert can't tell you like who you want to work with or what you're working on , what your work week wants to look like. Or do you want to see clients every day or three days a week or those are decisions that you have to make for yourself and no roadmap is going to give you those decisions. So , um, again, I think it, yeah, totally, totally, like all of those pieces. Um, of course it's not true that you don't , we don't want to work. Like, I almost feel like we want to work too much. We don't want to work for somebody else telling us what to do. Yeah. Well, I can tell you after, after many years in business as a business owner, you get to the point where you're like, no, I'm okay. I'm okay with taking my evenings off. I'm okay. Like, no one's dying and no one's going to die if I don't get this course launch on the date that I chose to because it was arbitrary. Wait , we are coming up on time, but I wanted to just ask you, what's next for you? You've got so many, so many, you know , you've been pivoting and you've been following these new directions, but now what's now, what's next for you? So , um , I am , um , and this is like new, new, new, new , um, I am launching , um, monthly free workshops around how to create moments of magic. Um, so creating more ease and joy. So we're having one next Monday, the 25th. Um, and the topic is could be communication. So how to create more joy, more joy and ease around communicating with others. Um, the um, and I have a brand new kind of offer that's going to spin off on that. The workshops are no pitch, no, it's really just a way to create more of a community and connection around people who are having the same uh, thoughts and just letting us all know we're not alone. Um, and I have an offer called moments of magic , uh, that is um, new, new, new, new, new and it's an eight week coaching program that I'm going to be launching in January around , um, [inaudible] around how do you have all the things we've talked about. So , um , there's going to be the piece of, of communication, the piece of finding the fun with your kids, the piece of finding the fun in yourself, connecting and healing those emotional wounds, all of that. Um, and uh, and so it's going to be a one-on-one offering, but , um, yeah, but I'm working on launching in January, so , uh , that's it. That's, that's, that's what's new with me. Those are super exciting. And what kind of support do you need from this community in order to get there? Um, you know, I mean, you know me so well. So much of it is just being held accountable. Um, I do have so many things on my plate and I have all these new ideas that come up all the time. So, and I have a limited amount of time not be like , because I've set these boundaries for myself, not a scarcity thing, but it's really like, these are the hours I want to do my work in and I want to stay true to that. So , um, so staying accountable to actually doing what needs to be done and being able to really talk it out and Mmm . And just have somebody, you know, you the community call me on my like , uh , B BS . But also like you're sending , you're like, these are too many things. Like you really can't do that all in the time. Cause like [inaudible] I'm the master at underestimating how long something's gonna take. So I think there's like, I think there should be a master's degree in this because so many of us are good at it. Um, but I really need people to call me out and be like, double that, Marissa . Like it , it will take you 30 minutes to do it if you weren't like in your own brain. So give yourself an hour, cause you will be in your brain for the first 30 minutes of it. And that's okay. There's nothing wrong, you know yourself. And that's probably the most important thing. I'm the same way. I do, I do. I have little hacks like that too because I just know myself. So, you know, I struggle with , um, staying focused on my workouts. And so my little hack is, this sounds ridiculous, but I have to wear my workout clothes in the morning even though I'm not going till the evening or I won't do it. Right . I've started just going out for a walk in like my jeans. Yeah , yeah. If we all had Katie talked about this, Katie would, and um, I like she said that she, she just sent out a newsletter where she was like, she gets on her bike and rides around for 10 minutes and then comes back. And that's like her transition. That's our commute and morning commute. So that like when she walks into her house, it's like, Oh, I'm at work. Oh, I love that. And so these little hacks are so good to have. And part of that again, is connecting to yourself and what you need , um , and then asking for the help. So , um, I'm not the best at asking for help either, as you know. So this is my asking for help from the community to hold me accountable and be like, that looks like a whole lot of things and also practicing what I preach. Right. They call me out on it. Like is that fun? Do you really want to be like sending out like launching this way? Um, cause one of the things, and I'll just share this with you quickly cause I know we're at time, but um, one of the things is that I love to talk obviously. And so what I noticed was , um , with this last, the very first I called it a webinar, but it was more of a workshop and that's what led to this moment of magic , um , workshop series is that , um, the thought of actually having to do Facebook ads, the thought of having to put it out there of like creating the social media, like all of the stuff felt so heavy that I wasn't doing it. And I was like, you know what? Like I don't need 20 people to show up. Um , so I'm just going to reach out person to person and send emails and voice messages. And just ask people, and I'm not going to put it on social media , um , you know , or push it on social media because that doesn't feel good for me. I'm not comfortable there. And I got my 20 people to sign up, 20 people didn't show up live but 20 people signed up. So I have 20 new subscribers. I have 20 people who, you know, are clearly interested in the topic, which was like, you know , yes this is the right topic that you should be talking about right now. People need this by doing it my way. And um, that was super powerful for me and super powerful to see like I can do it my way, I can talk to people one on one and I had no problem reaching out to 50 people to get 20 people and I think I was

50 people. I reached out to like maybe 25 cause people just sort of shared it and stuff. [inaudible] so it didn't even take that much time and it was so much fun. Cause I get to talk to people who I haven't talked to in a long time and I was like, Hey, let's chat. So people totally under estimate that they're like, Oh , we have to build this big campaign. I'm like, you're going to sell through your relationships. So just reach out. Okay. We're at time. Marissa , you know, I could talk forever but we probably will. But thank you so much for taking the time to chat with me today. Can you tell the listeners where to find you? And of course we'll put everything in the show notes as well. Yeah. So you can find me on Facebook at um , and Z , our coaching , um, or on my website, Marissa raymond.com. Um , my website is, I'm kind of rebranding it, so , um, there's all this stuff is there, but um, you know, absolutely reach out to me and you can email me at Marissa, Marissa raman.com right. And you can find her in our group, the real deal business coaching group. And you mentioned that you ran through and then like I'm there, I'm out there. So you mentioned that you had a free offer to share with our listeners. Can you tell us more about that? And of course we'll post a link to the, to it in the show notes. Yeah. So , um , yeah, so I um , I just want to do for your listeners , um , these like 15 minute discovery, like laser focused. Like let's find your fun. So 15 minutes, get on a call with me and you will walk away with like a personalized, here are ways to get into finding the fun in your life , uh , to help you guys start in. Awesome. What an amazing gift. Okay, so we're going to wrap up, but this has been such an amazing conversation and Marissa , you are always so fun to talk to make sure you go and check out Marissa and her incredible offer. We'll put everything in the show notes and thank you so much for tuning in today to hear this story. The episodes you're listening to are all featuring members of my free private Facebook group called the real deal business coaching group where we have daily prompts to keep you focused on building your business and sharing your everyday challenges, biweekly virtual coffee chats and open coaching and member support from an incredible community. If you'd like to join our community or you'd like to be featured on this show, I would love for you to come and hang out with us in the group, the links in the show notes or search up real deal business coaching in Facebook to find us. And finally I would love for you to join us on our next episode where we're going to be speaking to Darlene Holly , who Marissa knows, she's a branding and business clarity coach who helps ambitious, heart-centered online entrepreneurs who want to create a successful personal brand and business. So thank you again for being here, Marissa, and thank you again for being here of you're listening and if you've enjoyed today's content, I would love for you to give us a review on whatever platform you're on. This helps us share these stories with an even bigger audience. And so until next time, keep building, keep dreaming, and keep being real.